#201 2013-01-17 14:39:49
WikiLeaks Movie Crew Start Filming in Reykjavík
Amusing irony:
Actor Benedict Cumberbatch of the BBC adaptation series Sherlock will play Assange
.jpg/220px-Benedict_Cumberbatch_2011_(jpg).jpg)
Last edited by whosasailorthen (2013-01-17 14:40:42)
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#202 2013-01-17 14:46:30
Here is another recent update. Apparently the judge has ruled that poor Manning will not be able to argue he did it as a matter of conscience.
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#203 2013-01-17 15:24:25
Well, that's fuuuuuucked.
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#204 2013-01-17 16:25:44
Dmtdust wrote:
Well, that's fuuuuuucked.
I tend to agree with the judge, I can't see where conscience is an alleviating motive in this situation. However you know my position, I know yours, we disagree on the subject. Let's just leave that dog to his afternoon nap.
This however:
Prosecutor Maj. Ashden Fein said the delays were reasonable given the complexity of the case and the huge volume of classified material to be reviewed and cleared by various government agencies for use in the court-martial.
Complete and utter bullshit, it only took one, a single one, of the many, many documents to convict him; everything else could then have proceeded at the current pace. I know these are all highly trained lawyers etc., but it baffles the mind to realize how badly they've mishandled the case. For example: Article 134 allows you to lock some one up for quite a time for breaking the good order, Article 92 for willfully disobeying an order or regulation; the list goes on and on.
There were many things they could have done to protect his 6th Amendment Rights and the fact that they trampled all over them really pisses me off; Constitutional rights are not to be taken lightly.
Last edited by Emmeran (2013-01-17 16:26:44)
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#205 2013-01-17 17:05:16
Em wrote:
Constitutional rights are not to be taken lightly.
Unless, of course, you are the president and you want to change the 2nd amendment via imperial fiat.
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#206 2013-01-17 18:02:49
phreddy wrote:
Em wrote:
Constitutional rights are not to be taken lightly.
Unless, of course, you are the president and you want to change the 2nd amendment via imperial fiat.
Take it back to it's own thread - spouting that bullshit to a career military man and lifetime gun-owner is pointless and stupid. This thread has a specific point; I'll debate with you over there about your rights to own and operate your very own predator drone.
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#207 2013-01-17 18:30:18
Emmeran wrote:
phreddy wrote:
Em wrote:
Constitutional rights are not to be taken lightly.
Unless, of course, you are the president and you want to change the 2nd amendment via imperial fiat.
Take it back to it's own thread - spouting that bullshit to a career military man and lifetime gun-owner is pointless and stupid. This thread has a specific point; I'll debate with you over there about your rights to own and operate your very own predator drone.
You were commenting about a post I made dear Em. And the absurdity of your statement about how our constitutional rights are not to be taken lightly just couldn't stand. Especially when they are under severe attack. Now, carry on with the flogging of young Manning.
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#208 2013-02-10 01:41:35
#209 2013-02-10 18:04:37
Yeah... because Aljazeera is always where I go to get an unbiased opinion of American politics and society.
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#210 2013-02-10 18:27:25
Al Jazeera is pretty mainstream at this point, try Alarabiya if you're looking for biased.
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#211 2013-02-24 17:25:08
#212 2013-02-24 17:44:04
#213 2013-02-24 17:59:47
I forget, do we want him exonerated or executed?
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#214 2013-02-24 18:03:10
Baywolfe wrote:
I forget, do we want him exonerated or executed?
I think they should lock him up and throw away the key and Dusty strongly disagrees with me, but what we both agree on is that the situation should handled professionally and respect his rights. Which obviously isn't happening at this point.
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#215 2013-05-28 21:15:32
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#216 2013-06-03 17:03:46
and so the circus begins:
http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinio … 24213.html
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-22749745
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#217 2013-06-03 18:12:39
It's a damned good thing Dusty never served in the military. Otherwise, he would probably be doing life in prison for similar offenses.
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#218 2013-06-03 19:02:52
phreddy wrote:
It's a damned good thing Dusty never served in the military. Otherwise, he would probably be doing life in prison for similar offenses.
Jimi Hendrix was drummed out of the Army for, among other crimes, excessive masturbating.
If you boast an IQ above room temperature, you're more trouble than you're worth to any of the armed services. True story: I failed to enlist in the early 70s when I was shanghaied enroute to my physical by a houseload of lunatic Mormon coeds in Phoenix and force fed peyote.
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#219 2013-06-04 02:55:20
phreddy wrote:
It's a damned good thing Dusty never served in the military. Otherwise, he would probably be doing life in prison for similar offenses.
I grew up in the military. I knew it wasn't for me by the time I was 13.
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#220 2013-06-04 04:19:01
You're off base on this one Phreed, Dusty and I might disagree on guilt but the overall situation has been mismanaged beyond belief.
I'm almost at the "time served" phase just from the gross incompetence in managing the situation and I am very much at the point of agreeing that the political influence on the handling of this case is criminal in nature.
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#221 2013-06-04 04:55:54
Emmeran wrote:
You're off base on this one Phreed, Dusty and I might disagree on guilt but the overall situation has been mismanaged beyond belief.
I'm almost at the "time served" phase just from the gross incompetence in managing the situation and I am very much at the point of agreeing that the political influence on the handling of this case is criminal in nature.
I'm already there, Em. There is absolutely no excuse for the way he's been held, not even gross incompetence. He's already plead guilty to 'sharing' the information he was entrusted with, and no one has ever maintained that he wasn't guilty of that. Trying to make charges of 'aiding the enemy' stick will do nothing but further tarnish the reputation of military justice.
Cheney, Wolfowitz, Rumsfeld, and Associates have done enough damage on that score already, there's no need to inflict any more. Besides, if making information public becomes synonymous with aiding the enemy it may cause the public to wonder just who the government defines the enemy to be.
As if we didn't know.
Last edited by Tall Paul (2013-06-04 04:57:12)
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#222 2013-06-12 13:02:32
#223 2013-07-31 21:05:11
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#225 2013-07-31 22:33:04
Bradley Manning isn't about the truth, Edward Snowden however speaks of the truth. Atrocities in the act and fog of war are expected, this is why war is bad. This is why we should only go to war as the absolute last resort.
It is simply sad that people didn't realize this and act on it far earlier - now it's popular to read from a script and condemn the actions of those you sent off to fight for you; so much for no more Vietnams.
And sad little Bradley Manning will spend the rest of his life in jail because of this fucking mess, hell it's easy to see why the jarheads at Quantico locked him down so tight - if that boy had any balls he would have capped himself before they ever arrested him.
Just one more unfortunate casualty in a war that should never have happened.
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#226 2013-07-31 23:28:03
Nuremberg.
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#227 2013-07-31 23:42:11
Dmtdust wrote:
Nuremberg.
Look to the source not the shooters, these guys are simply weapons that you as a citizen allowed to be launched. The fault lies with the electorate as the shooters simply fulfill the wishes of the voters and please do not under estimate the fog of war. I can not even begin to describe how you feel when your brothers in arms are at risk, think maybe of your children; I would burn the entire world down to protect my children and I will kill anything that moves to protect my brothers.
**Edit: Manning swore an oath to protect his brothers in arms, he broke that oath and thus I hate his fucking guts and would torture his sorry ass given half a chance. I don't believe in the death penalty or water boarding but this pussy motherfucker has pissed me right the fuck off.
Last edited by Emmeran (2013-07-31 23:48:54)
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#228 2013-07-31 23:55:35
Nuremberg.
As the general says, no loss of life. Without someone with a conscience, anything, can and did happen. What Manning is is a voice of conscience against atrocity, and mismanagement at all levels.
I protested in the streets to stop the war going on, and have written innumerable letters and voted against it from the beginning. It lies also in the hands of soldiers... BLINDLY following orders.
If there is bravery in any of this, that little dude exemplifies it.
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#229 2013-08-01 00:13:40
I have to disagree. Manning is a punk ass bitch looking for attention and he got it.
Mismanagement and atrocity were the story line from the git-go - EDIT: (referring to the released data by Manning) however do not blame the arrow (or the pilot) blame the archer himself for the harm. We have trained these individuals and sent them into harms way in a strange land, the only thing they truly care about at that point is their brothers in arms; bad things will definitely happen.
We need to keep our troops out of these situations so these bad things don't have a chance to happen. Manning broke the oath and thus he shall pay but the true perpetrators never stepped into harms way.
However believe me this, the oath between brothers in arms should never be broken. As brothers in arms we need be able to absolutely trust each other when we share a foxhole, that's simply the way it is; as warriors we are co-dependent, I have to be able to rely on you. I'll frag the fucker that fucking chicken-shits on me like Manning did; why do you think the little bitch was hiding in his clothes locker when they arrested him?
It's interesting in the age of Snowden you still chose to support this guy.
Last edited by Emmeran (2013-08-01 00:15:30)
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#230 2013-08-01 01:14:20
Nuremberg.
As someone who was raised in a family who has largely been military for 200 years, I support him. We will always differ. Funny how you can support Snowden but not Manning. Interesting.
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#231 2013-08-01 01:18:22
Nurnberg = Imposed juxtaposition.
You ask us to be one thing and then condemn us for being that very thing.
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#232 2013-08-01 01:33:26
I asked for nothing.
All I ask is for us to find a better way that will take our youngsters out of harm. After the neolithic, the iron age, and now this, some one should at least get a clue.
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#233 2013-08-01 01:49:29
^This^
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#234 2013-08-01 09:03:46
Would you two please take this to a neighborhood bar somewhere?
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#235 2013-08-01 10:45:23
That's not a bad idea, any suggestions as I'm not familiar with the locals yet...
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#236 2013-08-01 10:48:53
Dmtdust wrote:
I asked for nothing.
All I ask is for us to find a better way that will take our youngsters out of harm. After the neolithic, the iron age, and now this, some one should at least get a clue.
Actually my friend you asked for the security which you have, we have provided that security however some assholes came along and changed the fucking equation again.
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#237 2013-08-01 12:37:29
Nope. Didn't ask for it. Huge assumption.
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#238 2013-08-01 14:10:30
Actually you did you just don't realize it. You assume it is a patent right to be secure in your living space and free from foreign threat. That freedom to simply exist has been provided to you by people who have assumed that chore. However the use of those forces assembled to protect our freedoms has been perverted and this is the issue we face today. Adherence to orders and duty are key components in a effective fighting force however the politico's understand this and will twist those traits to gain their own ends.
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#239 2013-08-01 14:16:11
#240 2013-08-01 14:26:23
Dmtdust wrote:
http://www.ratical.org/ratville/CAH/warisaracket.html#c1
Tell that to the Swiss.
Every able bodied Swill man is conscripted to serve in the military and remains duty bound to defend the country even after his active service. They remain armed and ready to do so. Women may also serve voluntarily. Therefore, all Swiss citizens are involved in providing the security Em mentions.
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#241 2013-08-01 14:30:51
Which is preferable to the military serving the corporate masters. My point.
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#243 2013-08-01 14:58:36
Dmtdust wrote:
http://www.alternet.org/education/educating-idiots
We agree that our system of education pumps out ignorant graduates who have no critical thinking skills. They are only suited to be ignorant consumers and dupes for politicians. However, I'm pretty sure we do not agree on the solution. We've tried the model which supports complete government control, tenure, strong teacher's unions, and lack of parental involvement in curriculum and choice of institutions. It does nothing but get worse. We need to make schools compete for students (and financing) by allowing parents to use education money where it buys the best education for their children. Until we do this, we will be mired in a flood of idiots flowing from our schools.
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#244 2013-08-01 15:12:10
Oi.
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#245 2013-08-01 15:57:12
phreddy wrote:
We need to make schools compete for students (and financing) by allowing parents to use education money where it buys the best education for their children. Until we do this, we will be mired in a flood of idiots flowing from our schools.
I'm going to vehemently disagree with you here, the idea of selling education to the highest bidder completely undercuts everything we have accomplished in the last 237 years. Outsourcing and capitalization will not fix bad parenting, education is the only answer. The concept of turning the education system into a McDonalds chain is just fucking crazy, the "disenfranchised" will just get stupider and we'll end up with a peasant society all over again.
Education is the duty of the parent, if you can figure out a way to mandate that properly I'm completely on your side. Now if you'll excuse me I'm teaching the boys how to split wood and shouldn't stay away too long.
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#246 2013-08-01 16:10:40
Em wrote:
the idea of selling education to the highest bidder completely undercuts everything we have accomplished in the last 237 years.
And what would that be? A society where only those who can afford a better education or school choice learn to read, that's what. I am not suggesting we outsource education. I am suggesting we allow parents to direct the money we spend on their children to the school of their choice. The schools can be public or private, but nonperforming ones will end up closed.
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#247 2013-08-01 16:28:52
phreddy wrote:
Em wrote:
the idea of selling education to the highest bidder completely undercuts everything we have accomplished in the last 237 years.
And what would that be? A society where only those who can afford a better education or school choice learn to read, that's what. I am not suggesting we outsource education. I am suggesting we allow parents to direct the money we spend on their children to the school of their choice. The schools can be public or private, but nonperforming ones will end up closed.
Welcome to India...
Besides, we already do that - it's called voting with your feet. Years back I moved Melons to Orange County so her boys could attend a better school, it was costly but productive. In the words of her youngest son: "They have grass on the play ground". It wasn't cheap or easy and we hated being separated but it did end up being worthwhile.
However it's in our best interest as a society to continue to mine the deprived areas as you never know what you will discover; leave no stone unturned.
Last edited by Emmeran (2013-08-01 16:34:57)
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#248 2013-08-01 16:42:46
Em wrote:
it was costly but productive.
Precisely. Didn't I just say that? Why, yes, I did
phreddy wrote:
A society where only those who can afford a better education or school choice learn to read,
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#249 2013-08-01 17:37:43
phreddy wrote:
A society where only those who can afford a better education or school choice learn to read,
That wouldn't have been me, I cut cord wood for a living as a youth. The argument doesn't hold water at any point, if you offer neither jobs nor education all you will get is crime - history bears out these facts. Educate, educate, educate...
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#250 2013-08-01 17:59:55
What Em said.
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