U.S. Marshals to local cops: don't say you're using stingrays, just pretend you have confidential sources.

When courts say it's A-OK for cops to lie, should anyone be surprised when they start lying to judges?

"However, the failure of law enforcement officials to disclose to courts the actual source of their information and to pretend that it came from a 'confidential source,' is deceptive and possibly fraudulent," he told Ars. "Affirmatively misleading the courts about the source of evidence in sworn warrant applications would clearly constitute a constitutional violation."

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Last edited by choad (2014-06-21 00:22:28)

Silly fellows; you think you can stop them with laws?

We know government and industry don't care about human rights.  Will they care when dollars are at stake?

"In the post-Snowden era, the appetite for European solutions on the part of governments and industry is increasing," said Wolfgang Rohrig, cyber defense project officer at the European Defence Agency. "Just look at how the cloud computing market has changed -- people walked away from US products."

Emmeran wrote:

Everyone, everywhere

Maybe we are going to get a little relief from all this, in the U.S. at least.  The Supreme Court just banned warrantless cell phone searches.

Keep your mouth shut, don't tell them you have the key.

Mr. Rogers said we should share, right?  The NSA loves to share with its buddies.

The big reveal is... that it's not just the NSA doing these searches, but the CIA and FBI as well. This is especially concerning with regards to the FBI. This means that the FBI, who does surveillance on Americans, is spying on Americans communications that were collected by the NSA and that they're doing so without anything resembling a warrant. Oh, and let's make this even worse: the FBI isn't even tracking how often it does this.

Fishing for tuna, and catching mostly dolphins.

In order to allow time for analysis and outside reporting, neither Snowden nor The Post has disclosed until now that he obtained and shared the content of intercepted communications. The cache Snowden provided came from domestic NSA operations under the broad authority granted by Congress in 2008 with amendments to the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. FISA content is generally stored in closely controlled data repositories, and for more than a year, senior government officials have depicted it as beyond Snowden's reach.

The Post reviewed roughly 160,000 intercepted e-mail and instant-message conversations, some of them hundreds of pages long, and 7,900 documents taken from more than 11,000 online accounts. . . .

By law, the NSA may "target" only foreign nationals located overseas unless it obtains a warrant based on probable cause from a special surveillance court. For collection under PRISM and Upstream rules, analysts must state a reasonable belief that the target has information of value about a foreign government, a terrorist organization or the spread of nonconventional weapons.

Most of the people caught up in those programs are not the targets and would not lawfully qualify as such. "Incidental collection" of third-party communications is inevitable in many forms of surveillance, but in other contexts the U.S. government works harder to limit and discard irrelevant data. In criminal wiretaps, for example, the FBI is supposed to stop listening to a call if a suspect’s wife or child is using the phone.

square wrote:

The Snowden-haters talk about horrible treason is.  So, what is it when a German agent spies for the U.S. on a parliamentary investigation?

Edit: How many more do there need to be before somebody raises a fuss?

Big deal.  Everyone spies on everyone else.  I'm sure the Germans have their spies embedded in our country.  We spy on our allies because they keep secrets from us, and us from them.  What bothers me more is when our own executive branch of government keeps secrets from us, from our journalists, and from our elected officials.  At least some of the journalists are finally waking up.  Note that 38 journalist groups signed this letter to Obama.

Emmeran wrote:

phreddy wrote:

Big deal.  Everyone spies on everyone else.  I'm sure the Germans have their spies embedded in our country.  We spy on our allies because they keep secrets from us, and us from them.  What bothers me more is when our own executive branch of government keeps secrets from us, from our journalists, and from our elected officials.  At least some of the journalists are finally waking up.  Note that 38 journalist groups signed this letter to Obama.

International spying is a given, the point is to not get caught.  Someone obviously screwed up.

As for the rest, well this has been an increasingly disturbing trend over the last 50 years - I wish I could assign it to party or system but it seems to be omnipresent.  I fear that the greater danger is buying into one side in the belief that they are different.  Fact is that they aren't; the politicians just want to get re-elected and the bureaucrats just want control.  And so the monster is fed with the ambitions of peons reaching for power and wealth.

You are probably correct in that the administration which finds itself in power tends to abuse that power.  Which is probably why John Acton said "Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Great men are almost always bad men."  The question here is who is abusing the power right now, and how do we resist or stop that abuse?  Throwing up your hands with an "Oh well, they all do it" doesn't do anything other than legitimize the abuse.  You have to call a tyrant out for being a tyrant and this is exactly what we now have.

phreddy wrote:

You have to call a tyrant out for being a tyrant and this is exactly what we now have.

And so silly boy - what would you call Bush?  Bush was anointed by SOC instead of elected and did whatever he wanted including starting wars - would Bush then be our "model tyrant"???

phreddy wrote:

Emmeran wrote:

phreddy wrote:

You have to call a tyrant out for being a tyrant and this is exactly what we now have.

And so silly boy - what would you call Bush?  Bush was anointed by SOC instead of elected and did whatever he wanted including starting wars - would Bush then be our "model tyrant"???

There you go again arguing that they all do it, so we should do/say nothing to stop it.  First, I will once again remind you that I started this thread, named the Bush-Obama Whitehouse.  Second, I will remind you that every notable Democrat, including Hillary, voted to invade Afghanistan and Iraq.  Yes, Bush used his power, but nothing like this turd swimming in our punch bowl.

So now we're reduced to arguing degrees of reprehensible?  You'll not change my mind that Obama has simply re-affirmed that the corruption runs deeper than either of us realized and that calling him names is a waste of time and energy. 

Fuck all of them.

square wrote:

Edit: How many more do there need to be before somebody raises a fuss?

Apparently, it takes only two licks to get to the Tootsie center.

phreddy wrote:

I'm sure the Germans have their spies embedded in our country.  We spy on our allies because they keep secrets from us, and us from them.

Well, we've only had a no-spying agreement with them since 1945.  That is, we used to have one.

Deny, Disrupt, Degrade and Deceive.

choad wrote:

Deny, Disrupt, Degrade and Deceive.

This is really scary shit.  When the government has the ability to manipulate and manufacture false public opinion, it can do anything it wishes because "it is acting on behalf of the majority of Americans".

Goebbels is spinning in his grave with unfettered jealousy.

Tall Paul wrote:

phreddy wrote:

choad wrote:

Deny, Disrupt, Degrade and Deceive.

This is really scary shit.  When the government has the ability to manipulate and manufacture false public opinion, it can do anything it wishes because "it is acting on behalf of the majority of Americans".

I know what you mean! I can still remember where I was when I learned that Romney had a lock on the Electoral College. Not only that, I hear that he's still the frontrunner.

Well, a hellova lot of people now wish they had voted for him.  I can only imagine the collective liberal heartburn were he to be elected in 2016.

The view from abroad.

phreddy wrote:

Interesting poll.  I wonder how many "suspected terrorists" their phone bank reached to garner those stats.

Define the current definition of terrorist please.

Emmeran wrote:

phreddy wrote:

Interesting poll.  I wonder how many "suspected terrorists" their phone bank reached to garner those stats.

Define the current definition of terrorist please.

Somebody we don't like.

New Snowden interview: NSA staffers pass around those photos of you getting pegged by a porn star.  (Video)

---

Plant documents stamped "Secret" in someone's house, send them directly to jail.

[The Australian] government will move to plug a "legislative gap" by making it an offence to copy, keep or remove sensitive intelligence information, or to make a record of information without authorisation - such as making notes of a meeting without approval.

These offences will carry up to three years' jail. At present, no crime is committed unless the copied material is actually handed over to someone else, but Senator Brandis told colleagues it could often be difficult to prove that the information had been passed on.

---

Should surprise no one that international human rights law has been broken along with many others, but noted for completeness' sake.

Emmeran wrote:

Back to the old

By old, you mean 6 days ago?

The Bush-Obama Whitehouse - Your privacy down the shitter

That is my typewriter, incidentally, and it's only on loan. I'll need it back sooner than later.

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square wrote:

New report on the Most Transparent Administration in History^TM.

That whine you hear is the rusty hing of a barn door closing after the horses have bolted. Our national press organs were gelded and compromised a generation ago. Probably accounts for the high pitch.

square wrote:

Lack of freedom isn't free.

Our government is adept at forging ahead with actions based on static analyses when the world simply doesn't work that way.  But, it's just too much trouble to work out a dynamic projection before blundering ahead.  The economic, political and environmental models on which our public servants impose restrictions to our freedoms are mostly bullshit.

choad wrote:

https://cruelery.com/sidepic/keith.alexander.png

Words fail. Seriously retarded.

So basically he raided us of all of our best talent to set up his own company.  With the fees he is quoting he can pay 20 quant security guys $3m per year to bring their knowledge of zero-day exploits discovered on our dime and never publicly exposed to his new corporate entity to reap a huge profit.

He should hang.



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Last edited by Emmeran (2014-07-30 14:41:09)

Apparently he doesn't know shit about security - you never pay more to fix a problem than it would cost to cover it up.